Lelouch plan is nonsense because of that.
Plenty of wars started immediately after world War 2. And Lelouch isn't even close to them (the biggest war crime of the war that he started was the Destruction of Pendragon, which was done by...Schneizel)
Schneizel destroyed Pendragon well before Zero Requiem became a thing
Using World War 2 as an example is nosense, applying realism to a story with several fantasy element does not make sense. It is believable because:
- Schneizel who was by far the biggest threat got instructed by his Geass which clearly means he's not a issue anymore
- Charles was dead
- Tianzi become the actual emperor of the Chinese Federation instead of being a puppet, and she's a pacifist.
- Britannia Empire under Lelouch deleted most of the internal issues, like colonialism, which started the whole Black Knights issue
- Zero still on paper existed thus people could still rely on a symbol of peace and hope that proved to work before extremely well.
You just can't use ww2 as an example. In real life there is nothing like a Geass to suppress your buggest enemy. Either way, Zero Requiem did not work just because "i will delete hatred". It worked because he practically estebilished an entire setting where the previous conflict just wouldn't exist anymore.
> some white boy who has never known conflict, living in a peaceful democratic country.
I am a Native American and my country had genocidal militias and mass sterilizations in the 1990s. Now currently they have fascist ethnonationalist gangs whose intellectual leader praised Hitler fighting the cops and killing inmigrants because their president who they worshipped did a coup to have unlimited power and failed.
I think there were far more realistic alternative to the Zero Requiem that didn't require Lelouch to LARP that could have lead to peaceful conclusion to the Collapse of the Holy Brittanian Empire (term that I use to the end of the Empire, it doesn't means mass death), but because the authors really wanted to end the series in a "happy ending"; they did a really bizarre plan to have a equally bizarre conclusion
> applying realism to a story with several fantasy element does not make sense.
The Zero requiem isn't using geass to brainwash the world into getting along. It's fair to use IRL behaviour of potencies and nations as a template in this case
In real life you have nothing like a Geass, not to mentions the political situation in the show is as different as it could be from real life. As i said, Zero Requiem did not brainwash people, but it was the last step of an estabilished setting.
> In real life you have nothing like a Geass
And that's why Lelouch plan is silly. Brainwashing everyone would have made more sense than his bizarre larping as a supervillain to ensure all his friends were in power and apparently made everyone sing kumbaya (except for the country whose only export are mercenaries XD)
All the conditions you mentioned didn't need Lelouch doing his larp
You think people would trust an empire that oppressed them for decades and exploited them as they possibly could? That's completely unbelievable in that setting, if anything. Showing that their ruler is dead thus ending their on worldwide vision is quite effective if you ask, especially if it's by the hand of the guy people gave their trust to ( well at least the japanese did).
>to ensure all his friends were in power
The black knights were his friends that betrayed him at episode 19? Lol
> You think people would trust an empire that oppressed them for decades and exploited them as they possibly could?
Go and watch basically all former empires who remain friendly with their past colonies. They don't need to forgive everything to reach a workable status quot
I love how Lelouch fanboys treat "hatred" as this abstract force above humans instead of the reality of conflict generating strong emotions among those affected by it.
In Eren’s case the “zero requiem” part was a rush job, he wasn’t trying to “fix” any of Paradise’s problems with the rumbling lol. His “yeah I’m trying to make you guys the heroes” part was him saving face, which he drops a few pages later. If he really wanted to *actually* go through with Zero Requiem, then yeah he absolutely should’ve had a lot more setup in doing so, but this Eren is *far* past character-assassinated so we get this shit instead 💀
When I first started watching and reading AOT I'd already been spoiled that Eren was going to try genociding a bunch of people (also "Mikasa, I always hated you" and "Ten years at least!" because of the memes), so as I was making my way through the series and seeing what Eren was going through I was thinking "Okay, I think I can see how Eren gets to the point of genocide. He is the end result of that long cycle of hatred and basically becomes the monster that will end the world for everything it's done. It's a tragic tale of hate and revenge."
Then it tried to make his intentions noble and his actions for the betterment of those he cared about...and I don't think that was quite as good. Maybe I was looking at things with too much of a bias but it was hard for me to picture Eren doing the rumbling for any in-character reason other than just pure revenge for everything the world had put him through.
The last chapter was a mess, he pretty much did genocide just because he wants to.
The argument that he did it for his friends is shaky as well, considering he admitted to not knowing if they would even survive the war. After the reveal that he also killed his mom btw.
So, he killed all of his blood relatives and step mother for armin and mikasa to live?
Ehhhh???
>it was hard for me to picture Eren doing the rumbling for any in-character reason other than just pure revenge for everything the world had put him through.
Well, it's kinda like that. Read chapters 131 and 139. There are some parts of these chapters where Eren actually says that wiping out most of humanity wasn't simply a mean, but an end in itself.
"When I learned that humanity existed outside the walls...I was... disappointed. So I wished to wipe them all".
It was less a matter of revenge and more of Eren's frustration with the fact the world outside the walls was nothing like he imagined it to be. But it was absolutely a more egotistical wish than saving the world and his friend.
>Then it tried to make his intentions noble and his actions for the betterment of those he cared about
Said it before, will say it again
If you are going to have an evil MC, *just have an evil MC,* all that backtracking from evil to noble, always ruins characterization
Erens plan was "Kill everyone, and if I get stopped halfway through that's ok because they will still be too crippled to get revenge any time soon". He wasn't trying to be clever.
That's psychotic because then the entire world and Paradis gets genocided just so his 6 friends get long lives.
What kind of fucking weird message is that. And the story ends with them all grateful for it.
But he literally says he won’t leave Paradis’ fate up to chance and then immediately leaves the fate of the island up to chance by leaving 20%
Before the last chapter anyway where all of a sudden he doesn’t know why he wants to do it and it’s “just something he always wanted to do” dogshit
Because he was conflicted and was always "the worst person to possess the coordinate". He wanted to destroy the world but was too much of a pussy to fully go through with it, that's basically what the story is telling you. Like imagine if Floch would have had the founding Titan? He wouldn't have folded like Eren or done something like cry to Ramzi about killing him in the future. He would have just done it and succeeded cuz he was built like that. But Even just wasn't which is why he failed cuz of his own pussyness.
Paradise would be genocided either way anyway we don't know why paradise island got attacked it is left ambiguous. It was hundred years ago and unlike before Marlay wasn't there to remind the world of the threat of titans with its wars
It's not left ambiguous!!! Almost every character states that Eren being stopped means Paradis will be genocided. It's not an unrelated genocide put in at the end for shits and giggles. It's openly stated to be inevitable if Eren is stopped multiple times!!!
Lol I think you are confused I'm referring to after Mikasa died.
After Mikasa died we don't know why they went to war remember the last time they were all reminded about how dangerous Eladians are because they could turn into titans. Also the Eladians were the ones who won the war for Marly.
Why this next generation went to war with one another we don't know
It's literally stated multiple times by almost every character.
"If Eren is stopped, Paradis will be genocided."
Floch states it, Hange says it twice, Jean, Onyankopon Eren, Armin, Mikasa, Connie, Samuel, Daz...
It's the central theme of the ending. It's the entire basis for the Alliance's sacrifice.
The entire point is that the Alliance believe it is better to be genocided than to live through genocide.
It's stated multiple times that the ending is a Trolley Problem where the choice is up to the Alliance whether the track that is run over is the outside world or Paradis.
The entire BASIS of the stakes of the ending is who will be genocided, Paradis or the world?
Your idea that Isayama slipped and fell and accidentally drew an unrelated genocide of Paradis that just HAPPENS to look like the genocide of Paradis we are told WILL happen like 30 times is ridiculous.
If Paradis is saved and is not genocided by the outside world, it means that there was peace. It would mean Eren's decision to genocide 80% of the world was correct. It would mean the Alliance thanking Eren for genocide was genuine as it would be the reason they were saved.
It's too positive to believe, as you do, that peace was brokered due to Eren committing genocide, and that the only reason Paradis was genocided was because of some unrelated story beat.
The point of Paradis being genocided at the end is to show that Eren didn't succeed. Genocide wasn't the answer, because violence remained.
If Isayama showed a different ending where Marley and Paradis were at eternal peace after Eren's genocide, it would be Isayama stating genocide was the answer. So he didn't, he showed Paradis being genocided as a direct result of Eren's genocide, which does the opposite, it shows that Eren's genocide directly caused the genocide of Paradis.
🤦🏽♂️ did I ever disagree that if Eren was stopped that Paradise island wouldn't be genocided? Because at that time it would. But 100 years in the future we don't know why it was attacked.
Isayama never said genocide was the answer to peace, only mutual understanding but the world had already decided to view Paradise island as the enemies because of Maralys wars and fact they could transform.
100 years from now is a different time and different era with different people. Why would they go to war this time we don't know. But hey ignore this whole point
It was genocided because they stopped Eren. Literally stated like 30 times lmao. The entire point of the ending is "Better to be genocided than to live by committing genocide."
You think 80% of all people being genocided would be forgotten in 70-100 years? Absolutely not. It would never be forgotten. There are still wars happening over shit from 1000 years ago in real life.
70 to 100 years is roughly how long it would take for the outside world to get ready to genocide Paradis.
The point Isayama wanted to make was Eren successfully used Genocide to hold off the outside world long enough so that the ten people who matter in the world, his friends, get nice lives. Once the Alliance have their nice lives, their ancestors are moved to the outside world like the Tybers and it's now safe to painfully extinguish the evil Paradisians.
I don’t get why people don’t understand this. They hated them like 2000 years then one of them kills 80 percent of the world. No shit they’re going to be angry
No offense, but I GENUINELY do not understand how anyone can think this is 40's tech. A child would know that pre-dreads, zeppelins, and armored trains is 1910's tech. Honestly, knowing that it's pre-dreads and not actual dreadnought battleships could even push this to be 1900's. You saying it's from the 40's is likely said in bad faith, as I refuse to believe someone can be that ignorant on general aesthetics.
Does AoT look steampunk or dieselpunk to you? Exactly, that's what I thought. I agree with your post and think the ending is dumb, but arguing that AoT is in the 1940's to bring about that argument is simply ridiculous.
I mean, if you scroll through my replies i said it wouldn’t matter. It still wouldn’t take 100 years for them to effectively nuke paradis to kingdom come.
Fair enough. Even if the tech advances more slowly (which it probably would given that the world has been deleted), it honestly wouldn't take too much time for everyone to get revenge.
Eren's original intention was to save the entire island and not just his friends but since he knew he'd fail in the end anyway because of all the contradictions and conflicted feelings in his mind he just settled for saving his friends because that's all he could accomplish.
Idk why you think there's supposed to be some deep message associated with this when clearly this is meant to just represent the tragedy of what happens when people go too far and things don't go how they expected.
Eren knew [he’d be stopped](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/2.jpg), he just said that if he weren’t [he’d reduced everything to dust](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/16.jpg).
It really does make me sad, because I do love the show/manga. But the whole "I left you your free will so you could stop me." was SO dumb beyond belief I almost didn't bother finishing the manga lmao
At least you saw it coming before these idiots that were somehow surprised by this being the ending. Like wtf did these people think was gonna happen when he let them keep their abilities after them saying he probably wants us to stop him.
Also missing that destroying 80% of humanity is not conducive destroying to 80% of infrastructure everywhere. The Rumbling would transplace most populations into a new state now united against a common enemy. If they wanted to, a new global fleet could be constructed with 8-15 years, sooner if they consolidated their manpower and resources.
To be fair I'm pretty sure flattening 80% of humanity is destroying 80% of infrastructure also. Since AoT is like in the 1930s-1940s the total population would be like in the 2 billion it will most likely be 4hundred million after the rumbling. The survivors will need to survive with little food left since rumbling would have flattened almost everything. Lets not forget these people may be at different locations.
The Rumbling didn’t touch everything everywhere. It was a comb over the Earth. Entire continents and nations would be still intact and untouched since 80% of humanity is barely one half the globe. Refugees would obviously make their way to these intact nations because that’s what people do after a national disaster, immigrate.
The most likely continent to be unaffected by the Rumbling is North America, whose natural geography lends itself to self sustainable farming. Would there be a famine? Sure, in the effected regions, but famine would be barely and issue if they got to work and they’d still have the food left untouched in those surviving nations.
> Refugees would obviously make their way to these intact nations because that’s what people do after a national disaster, immigrate.
The very act of migration will kill a lot of people, let's remember that Mass Deportations are widely considered a genocidal act on itself (see. Trail of Tears, Armenian deportations of 1914, Chechen deportation in the Soviet Union, etc)
The reason is very obvious, you can't just throw a lot of people to walk across a area that they know nothing about and expect them to NOT start dying in mass.
The Rumbling wouldn’t suddenly force them into uninhabitable, undeveloped land. Everyone regardless of where they were at would have headed further North (technically south). They’d likely be fleeing by following northern roads/tracks in which they’d hit ghost towns filled with abandoned supplies and livestock that the previous inhabitants left when they themselves fled north. The more lucky would already have a car, horse, or boat in which they’d be using to flee anyway. The conditions would be far more favorable compared to something like the Trail of Tears.
Edit: cardinal directions in mirrored worlds suck.
Who says it didn't reach America like it reached all the way to Azumbaito Clan which if i remember is in north or south america. Also who says these people will be willing to share their resources and how will they be able to travel that distance without a good boat and enough food. There are lots of factors that go against people working together and accepting refugees.
It would take years for the world to fully recover and that's if they don't try to fight one another
Azumabito were geographically east Asia + maybe Australia. The Rumbling would have to cross the empty pacific or the Atlantic to make it to the Americas. Even then, it would still hit South America first before making it to NA. North America would be the furthest location away by distance.
But since you want to work this out logistically, we can go deeper into this. Fort Salta (Where Eren dies) is located approximately around the interior border of Algeria. He was spearheading the Rumbling which means that no Titans would be able to make it further north since Fort Salta was his biggest priority. We see they make it to Hizuru, so the Rumbling actually went further East than north somehow. Now, Marley is actually an intercontinental empire and they have territory in what is South America as well. This doesn’t matter, since we can probably assume the titans don’t make it to this territory given the distance we see they do reach.
This means Eren wouldn’t reach Europe, North Asia, probably not South America, and most certainly not North America. This also means that 80% of humanity‘s population centers didn’t even account for half of the globe. The people in the affected countries would just have to make their way north to find untouched land. Of course, these nations would have untouched boats for transport as well.
Btw, if anyone wants to use the Big Ben London lookalike to somehow prove the Rumbling made it to Europe, you have to justify how they passed Eren which is just impossible.
In AoT it would be in south america actually remember its is reverse of the our world. So yeah it reached South America. Seems like titans are fast swimmers if the titans could reach Hizuru what makes you think they wouldn't have attacked "Europe."
Doesn’t really matter. I’m just equating them geographically to our world. Whenever I say north and east, you can think south and north if you want. We still have to scale the entire world up by a factor of about 3-4 since we have to account that the walls wouldn’t fit on Madagascar and they can’t see the coast from atop Wall Maria. If they swam to Europe, they’d have to swim entirely around the quadruple-sized African continent. It just becomes stupidly impossible at that point and any suspension of disbelief leaves the narrative.
They didn’t. My guy, look up the map. There’s only one with clear territory markings in the entire manga, and that’s just of Marley. Marley is the only nation with territory in South America. Hizuru (aka the Azumabito’s nation) is never even defined geographically in the manga. We just speculate that its territory is somewhere past the Mideast alliance whose territory is already speculative based on the name. They didn’t reach South America.
Never mind my statement that west is east btw. It’s just factually incorrect. AoT’s world is just a reflection over the x-axis not and complete inversion. Our East is still their east, and our west is still their west. East Asia is still east Asia, so yes, Hizuru is still east Asia.
It's set in between the 1900's to 1910's my guy...does AoT look Steampunk or Dieselpunk to you? I don't see metal monoplanes and streamlined cars anywhere. No aircraft carriers, and the battleships are all pre-dreads, which is a decade before WW1. Come on.
As someone who never read attack on Titan, i have a question. I always see the 80% number being thrown around. Was that a limitation in the power of the rumbling, or was it a deliberate choice? If deliberate, why?
That’s the number Eren gives for the amount of humanity he killed (or will kill to be technical) when talking to Armin in a flashback. 80%. How he knows how many people he killed is a plot contrivance. He supposedly was “trying” to kill 100% if he wasn’t stopped, but that’s not really true since he knew he would be stopped and did nothing to prevent his own death.
It’s just dumb writing that won’t make sense if you think about it long enough. Which is the issue and why there’s so many of these posts.
Yeah, at least the Rumbling was shown as being actually ugly, the Zero Requiem is just Lelouch larping as a villain while Schneizel does the actual villains things so he can still look good.
Lelouch abolished apartheid to become the most hated tyrant of the world.
Truly a genius
(This is sarcasm, if anyone wonders, Lelouch's supervillain larp is bad even as larp)
Great points
AOT aftermath reminds me of WW1's, Germany was left destroyed and with a ton of debt, and that resentment fueled fascism and Hitler's hard policies for fast growth and militarization
Now imagine the survivors of humanity, all of them full of hatred and resentment, joining together against a common enemy
Yeah that ain't going to be pretty
Code Geass reminds me more of the aftermath of WW2's Europe, where all of the countries were too damaged and tired to wage war again on the short term, with the USA and URSS strong enough to become the new big powers
In this case Suzaku and Schenider were the USA and URSS, its a much different scenario
> Code Geass reminds me more of the aftermath of WW2's Europe, where all of the countries were too damaged and tired to wage war again on the short term, with the USA and URSS strong enough to become the new big powers
And then China reignited its civil war, featuring veterans of WW2 fighting each other almost inmediately after the victory celebrations and featuring things like the Siege of Changchun, where the Maoist forces killed as many people as the Nanjing Massacre. Then eventually Mao won and carried policies that killed tens of millions more.
Oh and of course, you have the conflict between India and Pakistan after the collapse of the IRL British Empire, which lead to wars that killed millions of people too.
Heck, even in Europe itself ("the peaceful"), you had things like the Continuation War, which was the aftermath of WW2 itself. And pretending itself was peaceful is hilarious, you had all tons of small conflicts and tensions, especially in Eastern Europe.
> AOT aftermath reminds me of WW1's, Germany was left destroyed and with a ton of debt, and that resentment fueled fascism and Hitler's hard policies for fast growth and militarization.
That's a way to excuse the people of Germany for their genocidal antisemitism and fantasies against Slavs.
"Look, the Brits did bomb us during WW1, that's why I think we should kill the jews and enslave the slavs"
Comparing Marley's revenge after the Rumbling with the Holocaust is very close to Nazi Apologia
>Comparing Marley's revenge after the Rumbling with the Holocaust is very close to Nazi Apologia
There you go, playing the victim card, sorry man but that desnt work when there are actual superpowered individuals involved
Why would the rest of the world not take revenge for the rumbling?
This is a point in the post, the way Eren "fixed" things is fixing nothing
Now you come and mention those flaws as anti semitism... as a counterargument?
"Yes, the flaws n Eren's plan are going to cause a gigantic revenge from other countries"
Your tone sounds like you are opposing the post, but your arguments are supporting it
Yes, exactly this!! The only thing Eren did was prove people's fear of Eldians ending the world *completely correct*. Okay, so he let the people *no one knows about* kill him. Cool. This does nothing to distract people from the fact that all it takes is *one* unhinged Eldian to end the world - doesn't matter how peaceful the others are. At absolute best, he just sealed their fate but kicked it down the road a few decades AND destroyed any country's incentive for keeping the island devils specifically alive (they clearly don't have any measures to actually stop anyone who wants to do the rumbling and has the ooert to do so (besides the obvious solution of just killing them)).
Eren didn't want to pull a Zero Requiem in the first place.
He was doing a full rumbling and showed resistance to his friends so that they wouldn't interfere and would live long (jailing them is a good example).
When he visits paths after Gabi shoots him, that's when he stops showing resistance to his friends and makes a speech to goad them and make himself the devil for the world.
He then proceeded to save face in front of his friends and lie that he was pulling a ZQ all along until he spoke the truth in front of Armin, who didn't tell anyone else.
The AOT fandom has to have the biggest problem with reading comprehension I’ve ever seen. Eren was not trying to push no zero requiem type of plan he just wanted to kill those motherfuckers and he failed because of his friends. Eren wasn’t trying to break down any systems because there wasn’t going to be a system after he was done with the rumbling.
> he just wanted to kill those motherfuckers and he failed because of his friends.
Except the last chapter revealed that he always knew there was a good chance that he was gonna fail thanks to knowing the future and also because Ymir wanted it or something
More than that, Eren explicitly says everything he did was to arrive at Mikasa’s choice, which suggests Eren specifically orchestrated things so that his friends would end up killing him
He only did that because he personally didn't want to go through with the full rumbling, setting up his friends to look like heroes was just an afterthought.
Let's ignore the fact that lelouch didn't need to become a tyrant to achieve peace. All of you who think aot did a cg ending clearly need to reread the last few chapters
Lelouch didn't need to become a tyrant? He literally did a shit ton of atrocities to even become emperor in the first place. Using geass on people to override their wills, commiting mass murders, and intentionally being a huge asshole when emperor so people would unite when he died (like when he held the leaders of multiple nations hostage)
Yeah and he didn't need to do any of that I believe the public didn't know he was zero. Dude just decided to cause more carnage and suffering cause the writers suddenly wanted to make him a martyr. Might I add this doesn't achieve any form or longterm peace
The public didnt know the identity of zero which is specifically why he asked suzaku to kill him while disguised as zero. The anime states that zero is not a person but a symbol, and that anyone can wear the mask as long as they represent the ideal of justice. Lelouch desired to make zero kill the tyrannical emperor for that reason, to solidify zero exactly as this symbol of justice to unite the world.
Yeah exactly he ruled like a tyrant instead of fixing the mistakes of his father and the rulers before him to then get killed and thinking it will create peace for more than a couple of days. For a "smart character" he really has no idea how humans work
> Yeah exactly he ruled like a tyrant instead of fixing the mistakes of his father and the rulers before him
But isn't that exactly what he did? OP said it
> the moment Lelouch takes the throne he then quickly abolished many policies that grew during Charles' era. These included the elimination of the aristocratic system, serious penalties for financial conglomerates engaging in or a part of illegal or illicit activities, and the abolition of the Number-Area system, thus liberating them.
He did all the stuff that would actually free and liberate the people, albeit with the guise of ruling over them himself pretending to be an evil asshole
Because the idea is to create an enduring legacy in Zero specifically, not in himself. The whole thing was create an ideal that could not be defeated, in this case being "Zero, the liberator of justice" which would never die and unite the world. Also, he had already killed a bunch of people before that, ruling like some good guy would be not only hypocritical to his ideals but no different than the aristocracy beforehand.
Why do you think the "The only people who should kill are those prepared to die themselves" line from the beginning of the series came back?
Look, that's completely dumb. Not even holy figures like Jesus or Buddha are as unifying as "MUH ZERO".
Zero killing Lelouch would made him a hero, but that's because Lelouch decided to larp as a supervillain instead of just fixing things.
> ruling like some good guy would be not only hypocritical to his ideals but no different than the aristocracy beforehand.
I have some really bad news about how goverments work
Oh yeah killing himself definitely accomplishes more
You do realise the world being united doesn't last forever ?
Sure it might have been hypocritical to his ideals but if he wants results that should have been the right choice
> Might I add this doesn't achieve any form or longterm peace
To be fair, it's pretty impossible to get pure longterm peace. Forming a relatively peaceful and cooperative world seems to be the best you can get, and that's what Lelouch did.
Maybe I'm misremebering something I haven'tread since it came out, maybe it was a bad fan translation- but didn't Armin flat out ask Eren if he was pulling a Zero Requiem? and Eren said no, I want to protect Paradis (specifically my friends on Paradis) and nuking 80% of the world is the best means to achieve this end.
Eren at first explains what he's doing and after this Armin asks him again. And Eren doesn't answer implying that he's not truly being honest. And at the end of their talk he even admits he just wanted to do the Rumbling in the first place
The Zero Requiem stuff is him saving face, he intentionally stoked a fire under everyone's asses when he snuck into Marley to begin with
Armin:
>Eren….
Did you push us all away….
Just so you could set us up as the heroes that save humanity from destruction?
Eren:
>That’s right.
You all would then be the saviors to the people that survived.
Even among the island devils, there were some that opposed my actions and kept their humanity.
So I hoped that the world would hold you all in the highest regard.
https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/2.jpg
None of them actually worked at all. Just the Code Gease seem to work because of the execution even then not believable. Plus don't think Eren wanted to do the Zero Requiem. He just wanted to protect his nation and friends from the freedom and peace the world wouldn't have given to them.
Lelouch just destroyed his own nation and weakened it to the point they would end up only relying on Lelouch. It will lead to a power vacuum and other nations seeking power not peace at all. Similar situations happened in the world wars
I do understand it but thing is conflict will always happen at the end no matter what even AoT proves that even after 100 years there was conflict although we dont know why Paradise Island got attacked after 100 years. Meanwhile another story thinks sacrificing one person will end conflict and create peace.
I think you missed the part where Lelouch left arguably the smartest character in CG to serve Zero, the symbol of justice, to retain peace. Also, Lelouch plan was never to remove all conflict. His main reason for living has always been giving Nunnally a peaceful world to live in, which he did. Eren left the world to literal nobodies.
Yeah and how would that still create peace lol. You can be the smartest person ever but conflict will still exist. Pretty much it is false peace. Even Naruto series is aware peace is lie conflict will still exist even when the 5 nations united. Eren never claimed he wants to make peace at all
I love how you're downvoted by pointing the fact that even Naruto has more realistic geopolitics than Code Geass (where everyone is apparently a guillible moron except for Zero)
Stop being obsessed. AOT didn't copy Code Geass. If there was an anime to copy, it certainly isn't Code Geass.
Get off your high horse.
Your show isn't relevant anymore
Cry harder little boy, you were the first one who shitted your pants and throwing bunch of BS and now you are acting like a pro clown, Aot fans always have been aweirdos and bunch of low lifes
> eternal champions.
Eternal Champion protagonist is someone who genocides **his own species**. The complete opossite of the Rumbling.
Can Rumbling supporters stop lying?
The reason Zero Requiem worked for Code Geass and didn't for Attack on Titan is that Zero Requiem was writen in and for Code Geass, but not in and for Attack on Titan.
Might sound obvious, a bit stupid, but that's how it is.
Both series are different.
The final conflict of Attack on Titan was a very intense mix of emotions; people were done with their life, sanity, hopes, civilization, everything.
Eren wanted to kill so many things since the beginning of the story, then bombshell after bombshell of tragedies and revelations, things that happened, were happening, he had done, wanted to do, and many mysteries that popped here and there.
This Zero Requiem plan, that isn't even part of this series, is just a surface understanding of events with different undertones and reasonings.
It's like judging a steak as bad for not having ketchup like hamburgers do. Separate them, accept that they are different series, and accept they have nothing to do with each other.
It just feels like many people didn't try to comprehend the artistic message of the author, they didn't want to be immersed nor respect it as its own thing.
Seriously, Zero Requiem is the name of a plot point in a single series, it's not an universal concept; not everything that remotely resembles it is therefore it.
An unrelated series with an unrelated plot must not be judged as if it was constructed to be exactly Code Geass just because a bunch of people died and the MC was killed at the end.
Ever since the end of AoT back then, many people had so many weird comments, as if none had read the years of build up, the resolutions, the judgement, and personalities of the characters. It was simple cause and consequence in a broken world with broken people.
Well the sad thing is. Is That for Eren there was really no choice in the matter in preventing Genocide as the world was too hate filled to make peace and paradise who wanted to establish power over the world once more and Eren pick the best choice by planning a future we’re his friends live and in a way it succeed.
>Well the sad thing is. Is That for Eren there was really no choice in the matter in preventing Genocide as the world was too hate filled to make peace and paradise who wanted to establish power over the world once more and Eren pick the best choice by planning a future we’re his friends live and in a way it succeed.
Eren had a choice like it was his choice doing genocide when they could have went for Zeke’s plan or do partial rumbling then do negotiations which was closer to what [Lelouch did with him showing the world the terrible strength of Fleija.](https://youtu.be/xnFdY7168DY)
There’s more but the final arc was such a rush job that even the world building was so terrible it made every outsider nation look like comically evil irredeemable pieces of shit npcs.
>Eren had a choice like it was his choice doing genocide when they could have went for Zeke’s plan or do partial rumbling then do negotiations which was closer to what Lelouch did with him showing the world the terrible strength of Fleija.>
Even if Eren were to do a partial rumbling as Armin suggested it would only delay the inevitable due to mordern technology gradually overcoming the power of the titans.
What could Eren or Armin do if the nations of the world decide to bomb paradise from air assault, shred apart the titans with anti tank missiles or worse yet develop nuclear weapons?
Never-mind that Zekes plan through sterilization is still genocide of an entire race. Which also likely not prevent the eldains from being massacred regardless by the world at large.
>Even if Eren were to do a partial rumbling as Armin suggested it would only delay the inevitable due to mordern technology gradually overcoming the power of the titans.
Imagine your best strategist thinking their peace negotiations would fail without even trying… but then again, this was the same guy who wasn’t able to come up with anything in 4 years and was creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of attending meetings to save paradis. Lmao.
>What could Eren or Armin do if the nations of the world decide to bomb paradise from air assault, shred apart the titans with anti tank missiles or worse yet develop nuclear weapons?
Yeah, because paradis wouldn’t make technological advancements as well, they’d just sit on their asses depending on the power of the founder.
>Imagine your best strategist thinking their peace negotiations would fail without even trying… but then again, this was the same guy who wasn’t able to come up with anything in 4 years and was creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of attending meetings to save paradis. Lmao.>
They did tried and failed, because nearly everyone else hated in the word hated the eldians on paradise island and fear they would wiped them out by the rumbling if they didn’t wiped them out first.
The reason Armin could figure anything in four years wasn’t because he was too busy at his sealed up crush. It was do to the simple reason that people of the other nations are too unreasonable to negotiate.
>Yeah, because paradis wouldn’t make technological advancements as well, they’d just sit on their asses depending on the power of the founder.>
While also fighting against the combine armies of the entire world while their greatest weapons the titans have been made obsolete.
>They did tried and failed, because nearly everyone else hated in the word hated the eldians on paradise island and fear they would wiped them out by the rumbling if they didn’t wiped them out first.
[Looks at how hard Armin was trying here, he’d literally turned invisible](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-27-chapter-107-visitor/24.jpg). 💀.
[Look at all the plans they were able to tell eren when he asked about their plan.](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-27-chapter-107-visitor/30.jpg) 💀.
[Uhhhhhhh, this shouldn’t have even been Eren’s line and yet he’s the one who brought it up.](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-27-chapter-107-visitor/27.jpg).
When Eren said he’ll rumble their asses now, his best response was “[there must be some other way](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/15.jpg)”, like bitch? Didn’t i just give you 4 years to think of one and you sons of bitches thought of nothing?”💀.
> The reason Armin could figure anything in four years wasn’t because he was too busy at his sealed up crush. It was so to the simple reason that people of the other nations are too unreasonable to negotiate.
As i’ve said, it’s the result of terrible world building.
> While also fighting against the combine armies of the entire world while their greatest weapons the titans have been made obsolete.
Fighting, huh… interesting… the moment they do partial rumbling, fighting the eldians would be the last thing in their mind. Like making the wall titans literally encircle the island to ward off invaders would be a good deterrent.
>Looks at how hard Armin was trying here, he’d literally turned invisible. 💀.
Look at all the plans they were able to tell eren when he asked about their plan. 💀.
Uhhhhhhh, this shouldn’ have een Eren’s line and yet he’s the one who brought it up..
When Eren said he’ll rumble their asses now, his best response was “there must be some other way”, like bitch? Didn’t i just give you 4 years to think of one and you sons of bitches thought of nothing?”💀.>
Likely because they couldn’t find way in those four years because the people in the world are completely unreasonable due to their hatred of Eldains which the manga had point out several times before-hand?
I mean how is anyone suppose to find a solution to that aside from delaying the inevitable?
>As i’ve said, it’s the result of terrible world building.>
And terrible or not that is the reasoning why negotiations failed and why it is impossible for it to be solved in-verse.
Just in the same way lelouch plan only worked because the world building in their allows it to make it possible.
>Fighting, huh… interesting… the moment they do partial rumbling, fighting the eldians would be the last thing in their mind. Like making the wall titans literally encircle the island to ward off invaders would be a good deterrent.>
Or it would just convince the other nations to build and entire army fleet planes to fly over their titans and bomb paradise to oblivion before they do a full on rumbling…which is one the main reasons why he wanted to eliminate paradise to begins with.
>Likely because they couldn’t find way in those four years because the people in the world are completely unreasonable due to their hatred of Eldains which the manga had point out several times before-hand?
Again, it’s hard making up with plans when Armin was always shown creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of thinking up of anything, lmao.
>I mean how is anyone suppose to find a solution to that aside from delaying the inevitable?
Inevitable? Yeah, like how peace negotiations don’t exist.
>And terrible or not that is the reasoning why negotiations failed and why it is impossible for it to be solved in-verse.
It’s not impossible, they literally just did nothing to do something.
>Just in the same way lelouch plan only worked because the world building in their allows it to make it possible.
Lelouch’s plan worked because he actually thought what to do before and after he executed zero requiem like what I said in this post.
>Or it would just convince the other nations to build and entire army fleet planes to fly over their titans and bomb paradise to oblivion before they do a full on rumbling…which is one the main reasons why he wanted to eliminate paradise to begins with.
Like paradis couldn’t make them? Or the fact that eren literally could make countless flying jaw titans? Also, it’s hard to make advancements in technology when all your bases are destroyed.
>Again, it’s hard making up with plans when Armin was always shown creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of thinking up of anything, lmao.<
And what exactly would Armin be able to think of when all the negotiations did was direct the worlds hatred of the eldains to Marley to to those primarily to paradise?
>Inevitable? Yeah, like how peace negotiations don’t exist.>
When it comes to the Eldains and the rest of the world in Attack on Titan they clearly don’t.
>It’s not impossible, they literally just did nothing to do something.>
They tried to negotiate peace with an ally nation and the only thing they accomplish was redirect the worlds hatred from the Eldains in Marley to their own people on paradise.
>Lelouch’s plan worked because he actually thought what to do before and after he executed zero requiem like what I said in this post.>
Which again only worked because his own world building allowed it to happen. While Attack on titans on world building would make that impossible to happen.
>Like paradis couldn’t make them? Or the fact that eren literally could make countless flying jaw titans? Also, it’s hard to make advancements in technology when all your bases are destroyed.>
Eren does not have the power to create unique titans Ymir does and she wanted to flat out destroy the entire world when given the chance and this is completely ignoring that paradise is hopelessly outnumbered, outgunned and that is assuming they would somehow find out every single military base to world and destroy them without the use of the rumbling.
>And what exactly would Armin be able to think of when all the negotiations did was direct the worlds hatred of the eldains to Marley to to those primarily to paradise?
Armin is the strategist, not me. He should think of one instead of being some kinda weirdo. It’s not like that’s the only way to get out of this, lmao.
>When it comes to the Eldains and the rest of the world in Attack on Titan they clearly don’t.
It does but they’re too stupid to try.
>They tried to negotiate peace with an ally nation and the only thing they accomplish was redirect the worlds hatred from the Eldains in Marley to their own people on paradise.
They tried? They literally sat around like deer on headlights, lmao. And their brilliant strategist was nowhere to be found. Oh, wait, he’s down there in the basement feeling up annie’s crystal like some creep. 🤦♂️
>Which again only worked because his own world building allowed it to happen. While Attack on titans on world building would make that impossible to happen.
Like I said, better world building. Isayama is a hack who can’t write to save his life.
>Eren does not have the power to create unique titans Ymir does and she wanted to flat out destroy the entire world when given the chance and this is completely ignoring that paradise is hopelessly outnumbered, outgunned and that is assuming they would somehow find out every single military base to world and destroy them without the use of the rumbling.
Isn’t that basically the partial rumbling though? Which would give the, at least 50 years worth of time. Make your argument make sense, lmao.
Jesus fucking Christ I'm so sick of these dumbass Eren lelouch parallels. Eren plan/actions are literally nothing like Lelouch's because he didn't plan to save the world or anything at all. Eren's plan was the fucking rumbling. He **literally** wanted to kill all of humanity and only failed because he couldn't handle the guilt of what he was doing so he wanted to be stopped by having Mikasa kill him. There is no greater plan to save the world and he didn't believe Armin or anyone else's plan would work but just simply had to accept it since he knew he'd fail in the end anyway. Idk why tf people are over complicating shit when it's all there in black and white literally spelled out in the story itself.
The whole tricking the world thing has been done better and it’s still cheesy. Look at Watchmen, which is a literal masterpiece and mfs still completely miss points all the time. It’s a hyper realistic world and the final villains final plan is “squid monster kill some save many”, it’s a parody of sci fi writing itself. The other characters are looking at Veidt, the smartest man ever, like “you are so dumb yet so smart” and it works. The movie fucked up bc Zack Snyder couldn’t see the absurd side and actually just thought watchmen was another gritty and cool super comic when it’s half a parody of previous gritty comics (TDK Daredevil anything Frank miller tbh.)
AoT is like Code Geass but worse lmao, Eren is a bullheaded moron who’s also got a god complex. Then they reveal the future sight lmao so the plot shapes up to be “eren see, Eren do” he becomes a slave to his fate and not in smart way bc he never tried to fight it either. He just do, never looks for counsel just gets a bunch of likeminded idiots together and creates a cult of personality while escalating everything to do or die. Then we get another future sight 4d chess move bc Eren see his friends stop him and he dies for everyone along with the billions of innocent people he killed but he did it for his homies he’s such a genius. If I was 15 and only read manga I would think this was genius but I’m not and I’ve read actual brilliant shit lmao. Eren see Eren do baby
Lelouch killed the hatred between people and Eren just killed people💀
Uniting people against a common enemy vs uniting your enemies against a common people.
Lelouch plan is nonsense because of that. Plenty of wars started immediately after world War 2. And Lelouch isn't even close to them (the biggest war crime of the war that he started was the Destruction of Pendragon, which was done by...Schneizel)
Schneizel destroyed Pendragon well before Zero Requiem became a thing Using World War 2 as an example is nosense, applying realism to a story with several fantasy element does not make sense. It is believable because: - Schneizel who was by far the biggest threat got instructed by his Geass which clearly means he's not a issue anymore - Charles was dead - Tianzi become the actual emperor of the Chinese Federation instead of being a puppet, and she's a pacifist. - Britannia Empire under Lelouch deleted most of the internal issues, like colonialism, which started the whole Black Knights issue - Zero still on paper existed thus people could still rely on a symbol of peace and hope that proved to work before extremely well. You just can't use ww2 as an example. In real life there is nothing like a Geass to suppress your buggest enemy. Either way, Zero Requiem did not work just because "i will delete hatred". It worked because he practically estebilished an entire setting where the previous conflict just wouldn't exist anymore.
And in real life, there *was* peace. Yes there are proxy war, but relatively, we are living in the era of the Long Peace.
"Humanity will always be at war with eachother" - some white boy who has never known conflict, living in a peaceful democratic country.
> some white boy who has never known conflict, living in a peaceful democratic country. I am a Native American and my country had genocidal militias and mass sterilizations in the 1990s. Now currently they have fascist ethnonationalist gangs whose intellectual leader praised Hitler fighting the cops and killing inmigrants because their president who they worshipped did a coup to have unlimited power and failed. I think there were far more realistic alternative to the Zero Requiem that didn't require Lelouch to LARP that could have lead to peaceful conclusion to the Collapse of the Holy Brittanian Empire (term that I use to the end of the Empire, it doesn't means mass death), but because the authors really wanted to end the series in a "happy ending"; they did a really bizarre plan to have a equally bizarre conclusion
> there was peace. I wouldn't call literal tens of millions dying as a result of the direct aftermath of WW2 to be "peace"
> applying realism to a story with several fantasy element does not make sense. The Zero requiem isn't using geass to brainwash the world into getting along. It's fair to use IRL behaviour of potencies and nations as a template in this case
In real life you have nothing like a Geass, not to mentions the political situation in the show is as different as it could be from real life. As i said, Zero Requiem did not brainwash people, but it was the last step of an estabilished setting.
> In real life you have nothing like a Geass And that's why Lelouch plan is silly. Brainwashing everyone would have made more sense than his bizarre larping as a supervillain to ensure all his friends were in power and apparently made everyone sing kumbaya (except for the country whose only export are mercenaries XD) All the conditions you mentioned didn't need Lelouch doing his larp
You think people would trust an empire that oppressed them for decades and exploited them as they possibly could? That's completely unbelievable in that setting, if anything. Showing that their ruler is dead thus ending their on worldwide vision is quite effective if you ask, especially if it's by the hand of the guy people gave their trust to ( well at least the japanese did). >to ensure all his friends were in power The black knights were his friends that betrayed him at episode 19? Lol
> You think people would trust an empire that oppressed them for decades and exploited them as they possibly could? Go and watch basically all former empires who remain friendly with their past colonies. They don't need to forgive everything to reach a workable status quot
Lol you got dislikes even though it is fact
I love how Lelouch fanboys treat "hatred" as this abstract force above humans instead of the reality of conflict generating strong emotions among those affected by it.
Yeah it's almost like he wanted to destroy the world or something strange 🤔
In Eren’s case the “zero requiem” part was a rush job, he wasn’t trying to “fix” any of Paradise’s problems with the rumbling lol. His “yeah I’m trying to make you guys the heroes” part was him saving face, which he drops a few pages later. If he really wanted to *actually* go through with Zero Requiem, then yeah he absolutely should’ve had a lot more setup in doing so, but this Eren is *far* past character-assassinated so we get this shit instead 💀
When I first started watching and reading AOT I'd already been spoiled that Eren was going to try genociding a bunch of people (also "Mikasa, I always hated you" and "Ten years at least!" because of the memes), so as I was making my way through the series and seeing what Eren was going through I was thinking "Okay, I think I can see how Eren gets to the point of genocide. He is the end result of that long cycle of hatred and basically becomes the monster that will end the world for everything it's done. It's a tragic tale of hate and revenge." Then it tried to make his intentions noble and his actions for the betterment of those he cared about...and I don't think that was quite as good. Maybe I was looking at things with too much of a bias but it was hard for me to picture Eren doing the rumbling for any in-character reason other than just pure revenge for everything the world had put him through.
The last chapter was a mess, he pretty much did genocide just because he wants to. The argument that he did it for his friends is shaky as well, considering he admitted to not knowing if they would even survive the war. After the reveal that he also killed his mom btw. So, he killed all of his blood relatives and step mother for armin and mikasa to live? Ehhhh???
>it was hard for me to picture Eren doing the rumbling for any in-character reason other than just pure revenge for everything the world had put him through. Well, it's kinda like that. Read chapters 131 and 139. There are some parts of these chapters where Eren actually says that wiping out most of humanity wasn't simply a mean, but an end in itself. "When I learned that humanity existed outside the walls...I was... disappointed. So I wished to wipe them all". It was less a matter of revenge and more of Eren's frustration with the fact the world outside the walls was nothing like he imagined it to be. But it was absolutely a more egotistical wish than saving the world and his friend.
>Then it tried to make his intentions noble and his actions for the betterment of those he cared about Said it before, will say it again If you are going to have an evil MC, *just have an evil MC,* all that backtracking from evil to noble, always ruins characterization
Erens plan was "Kill everyone, and if I get stopped halfway through that's ok because they will still be too crippled to get revenge any time soon". He wasn't trying to be clever.
That's psychotic because then the entire world and Paradis gets genocided just so his 6 friends get long lives. What kind of fucking weird message is that. And the story ends with them all grateful for it.
Um... Yes, that's right. Did you think Mr Genocide had everyones best interests at heart?
Before the last chapter, most people likely thought he was just doing an extreme version of defending the island as a "best interest"
At the very least, Eren seemed to care about Paradis itself and its people. *Until he didn't.* For reasons only Ymir knows.
But he literally says he won’t leave Paradis’ fate up to chance and then immediately leaves the fate of the island up to chance by leaving 20% Before the last chapter anyway where all of a sudden he doesn’t know why he wants to do it and it’s “just something he always wanted to do” dogshit
Because he was conflicted and was always "the worst person to possess the coordinate". He wanted to destroy the world but was too much of a pussy to fully go through with it, that's basically what the story is telling you. Like imagine if Floch would have had the founding Titan? He wouldn't have folded like Eren or done something like cry to Ramzi about killing him in the future. He would have just done it and succeeded cuz he was built like that. But Even just wasn't which is why he failed cuz of his own pussyness.
I mean, his whole thing was to secure Paradis Eldians.
It's bizarre because if that was his reasoning and he succeeds it's basically a story where genocide succeeds and was the right choice lmao
Paradise would be genocided either way anyway we don't know why paradise island got attacked it is left ambiguous. It was hundred years ago and unlike before Marlay wasn't there to remind the world of the threat of titans with its wars
It's not left ambiguous!!! Almost every character states that Eren being stopped means Paradis will be genocided. It's not an unrelated genocide put in at the end for shits and giggles. It's openly stated to be inevitable if Eren is stopped multiple times!!!
Lol I think you are confused I'm referring to after Mikasa died. After Mikasa died we don't know why they went to war remember the last time they were all reminded about how dangerous Eladians are because they could turn into titans. Also the Eladians were the ones who won the war for Marly. Why this next generation went to war with one another we don't know
It's literally stated multiple times by almost every character. "If Eren is stopped, Paradis will be genocided." Floch states it, Hange says it twice, Jean, Onyankopon Eren, Armin, Mikasa, Connie, Samuel, Daz... It's the central theme of the ending. It's the entire basis for the Alliance's sacrifice. The entire point is that the Alliance believe it is better to be genocided than to live through genocide. It's stated multiple times that the ending is a Trolley Problem where the choice is up to the Alliance whether the track that is run over is the outside world or Paradis. The entire BASIS of the stakes of the ending is who will be genocided, Paradis or the world? Your idea that Isayama slipped and fell and accidentally drew an unrelated genocide of Paradis that just HAPPENS to look like the genocide of Paradis we are told WILL happen like 30 times is ridiculous. If Paradis is saved and is not genocided by the outside world, it means that there was peace. It would mean Eren's decision to genocide 80% of the world was correct. It would mean the Alliance thanking Eren for genocide was genuine as it would be the reason they were saved. It's too positive to believe, as you do, that peace was brokered due to Eren committing genocide, and that the only reason Paradis was genocided was because of some unrelated story beat. The point of Paradis being genocided at the end is to show that Eren didn't succeed. Genocide wasn't the answer, because violence remained. If Isayama showed a different ending where Marley and Paradis were at eternal peace after Eren's genocide, it would be Isayama stating genocide was the answer. So he didn't, he showed Paradis being genocided as a direct result of Eren's genocide, which does the opposite, it shows that Eren's genocide directly caused the genocide of Paradis.
🤦🏽♂️ did I ever disagree that if Eren was stopped that Paradise island wouldn't be genocided? Because at that time it would. But 100 years in the future we don't know why it was attacked. Isayama never said genocide was the answer to peace, only mutual understanding but the world had already decided to view Paradise island as the enemies because of Maralys wars and fact they could transform. 100 years from now is a different time and different era with different people. Why would they go to war this time we don't know. But hey ignore this whole point
It was genocided because they stopped Eren. Literally stated like 30 times lmao. The entire point of the ending is "Better to be genocided than to live by committing genocide." You think 80% of all people being genocided would be forgotten in 70-100 years? Absolutely not. It would never be forgotten. There are still wars happening over shit from 1000 years ago in real life. 70 to 100 years is roughly how long it would take for the outside world to get ready to genocide Paradis. The point Isayama wanted to make was Eren successfully used Genocide to hold off the outside world long enough so that the ten people who matter in the world, his friends, get nice lives. Once the Alliance have their nice lives, their ancestors are moved to the outside world like the Tybers and it's now safe to painfully extinguish the evil Paradisians.
I don’t get why people don’t understand this. They hated them like 2000 years then one of them kills 80 percent of the world. No shit they’re going to be angry
I doubt it’d reach a hundred years, maybe a few decades.
The technology jump proves at least 70 years, longer with Mikasa's death.
B2 stealth bombers are late 80’s tech. AoT is roughly set in the 40’s (WW2).
BS. AOT's aesthetic is clearly ww1. Mikasa does not appear to have kicked the bucket in her 60s.
I mean, even if you pretend it’s from WW1, it’ll only be 20 years prior, so…
That's still a significant jump. Let's say The Rumbling was 1914 and the bombing was 1988. That's 74 years and nowhere near a "few decades".
Not a hundred years either.
No offense, but I GENUINELY do not understand how anyone can think this is 40's tech. A child would know that pre-dreads, zeppelins, and armored trains is 1910's tech. Honestly, knowing that it's pre-dreads and not actual dreadnought battleships could even push this to be 1900's. You saying it's from the 40's is likely said in bad faith, as I refuse to believe someone can be that ignorant on general aesthetics. Does AoT look steampunk or dieselpunk to you? Exactly, that's what I thought. I agree with your post and think the ending is dumb, but arguing that AoT is in the 1940's to bring about that argument is simply ridiculous.
I mean, if you scroll through my replies i said it wouldn’t matter. It still wouldn’t take 100 years for them to effectively nuke paradis to kingdom come.
Fair enough. Even if the tech advances more slowly (which it probably would given that the world has been deleted), it honestly wouldn't take too much time for everyone to get revenge.
It's a hundred years you can see evidence with the tree growing and Mikasa dying old woman
Eren's original intention was to save the entire island and not just his friends but since he knew he'd fail in the end anyway because of all the contradictions and conflicted feelings in his mind he just settled for saving his friends because that's all he could accomplish. Idk why you think there's supposed to be some deep message associated with this when clearly this is meant to just represent the tragedy of what happens when people go too far and things don't go how they expected.
Eren knew [he’d be stopped](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/2.jpg), he just said that if he weren’t [he’d reduced everything to dust](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/16.jpg).
That and also the fact that he knew what he was doing was wrong and wanted his friends to stop him
The ending to AOT is just garbage
Nah it was ok
It really does make me sad, because I do love the show/manga. But the whole "I left you your free will so you could stop me." was SO dumb beyond belief I almost didn't bother finishing the manga lmao
At least you saw it coming before these idiots that were somehow surprised by this being the ending. Like wtf did these people think was gonna happen when he let them keep their abilities after them saying he probably wants us to stop him.
Also missing that destroying 80% of humanity is not conducive destroying to 80% of infrastructure everywhere. The Rumbling would transplace most populations into a new state now united against a common enemy. If they wanted to, a new global fleet could be constructed with 8-15 years, sooner if they consolidated their manpower and resources.
To be fair I'm pretty sure flattening 80% of humanity is destroying 80% of infrastructure also. Since AoT is like in the 1930s-1940s the total population would be like in the 2 billion it will most likely be 4hundred million after the rumbling. The survivors will need to survive with little food left since rumbling would have flattened almost everything. Lets not forget these people may be at different locations.
How did you get 400,000 survivors from a starting pop of 2,000,000,000? That's a survival rate of 0.02%.
Lol my bad guess didn't calculate well was using my head messed a few zeroes
Well, you’re still missing a ton of zeroes…
The Rumbling didn’t touch everything everywhere. It was a comb over the Earth. Entire continents and nations would be still intact and untouched since 80% of humanity is barely one half the globe. Refugees would obviously make their way to these intact nations because that’s what people do after a national disaster, immigrate. The most likely continent to be unaffected by the Rumbling is North America, whose natural geography lends itself to self sustainable farming. Would there be a famine? Sure, in the effected regions, but famine would be barely and issue if they got to work and they’d still have the food left untouched in those surviving nations.
> Refugees would obviously make their way to these intact nations because that’s what people do after a national disaster, immigrate. The very act of migration will kill a lot of people, let's remember that Mass Deportations are widely considered a genocidal act on itself (see. Trail of Tears, Armenian deportations of 1914, Chechen deportation in the Soviet Union, etc) The reason is very obvious, you can't just throw a lot of people to walk across a area that they know nothing about and expect them to NOT start dying in mass.
The Rumbling wouldn’t suddenly force them into uninhabitable, undeveloped land. Everyone regardless of where they were at would have headed further North (technically south). They’d likely be fleeing by following northern roads/tracks in which they’d hit ghost towns filled with abandoned supplies and livestock that the previous inhabitants left when they themselves fled north. The more lucky would already have a car, horse, or boat in which they’d be using to flee anyway. The conditions would be far more favorable compared to something like the Trail of Tears. Edit: cardinal directions in mirrored worlds suck.
Who says it didn't reach America like it reached all the way to Azumbaito Clan which if i remember is in north or south america. Also who says these people will be willing to share their resources and how will they be able to travel that distance without a good boat and enough food. There are lots of factors that go against people working together and accepting refugees. It would take years for the world to fully recover and that's if they don't try to fight one another
Azumabito were geographically east Asia + maybe Australia. The Rumbling would have to cross the empty pacific or the Atlantic to make it to the Americas. Even then, it would still hit South America first before making it to NA. North America would be the furthest location away by distance. But since you want to work this out logistically, we can go deeper into this. Fort Salta (Where Eren dies) is located approximately around the interior border of Algeria. He was spearheading the Rumbling which means that no Titans would be able to make it further north since Fort Salta was his biggest priority. We see they make it to Hizuru, so the Rumbling actually went further East than north somehow. Now, Marley is actually an intercontinental empire and they have territory in what is South America as well. This doesn’t matter, since we can probably assume the titans don’t make it to this territory given the distance we see they do reach. This means Eren wouldn’t reach Europe, North Asia, probably not South America, and most certainly not North America. This also means that 80% of humanity‘s population centers didn’t even account for half of the globe. The people in the affected countries would just have to make their way north to find untouched land. Of course, these nations would have untouched boats for transport as well. Btw, if anyone wants to use the Big Ben London lookalike to somehow prove the Rumbling made it to Europe, you have to justify how they passed Eren which is just impossible.
In AoT it would be in south america actually remember its is reverse of the our world. So yeah it reached South America. Seems like titans are fast swimmers if the titans could reach Hizuru what makes you think they wouldn't have attacked "Europe."
Doesn’t really matter. I’m just equating them geographically to our world. Whenever I say north and east, you can think south and north if you want. We still have to scale the entire world up by a factor of about 3-4 since we have to account that the walls wouldn’t fit on Madagascar and they can’t see the coast from atop Wall Maria. If they swam to Europe, they’d have to swim entirely around the quadruple-sized African continent. It just becomes stupidly impossible at that point and any suspension of disbelief leaves the narrative.
Yet they reached south america in the story that's where Azumbaito is that's the east.
They didn’t. My guy, look up the map. There’s only one with clear territory markings in the entire manga, and that’s just of Marley. Marley is the only nation with territory in South America. Hizuru (aka the Azumabito’s nation) is never even defined geographically in the manga. We just speculate that its territory is somewhere past the Mideast alliance whose territory is already speculative based on the name. They didn’t reach South America. Never mind my statement that west is east btw. It’s just factually incorrect. AoT’s world is just a reflection over the x-axis not and complete inversion. Our East is still their east, and our west is still their west. East Asia is still east Asia, so yes, Hizuru is still east Asia.
It's set in between the 1900's to 1910's my guy...does AoT look Steampunk or Dieselpunk to you? I don't see metal monoplanes and streamlined cars anywhere. No aircraft carriers, and the battleships are all pre-dreads, which is a decade before WW1. Come on.
Yeah and
As someone who never read attack on Titan, i have a question. I always see the 80% number being thrown around. Was that a limitation in the power of the rumbling, or was it a deliberate choice? If deliberate, why?
That's as far as Eren could do before the Scouts sliced his central control head. AOT time travel is deterministic
That’s the number Eren gives for the amount of humanity he killed (or will kill to be technical) when talking to Armin in a flashback. 80%. How he knows how many people he killed is a plot contrivance. He supposedly was “trying” to kill 100% if he wasn’t stopped, but that’s not really true since he knew he would be stopped and did nothing to prevent his own death. It’s just dumb writing that won’t make sense if you think about it long enough. Which is the issue and why there’s so many of these posts.
It just happened to be the amount left when the Alliance caught up with him.
both plans are stupid
Yeah, at least the Rumbling was shown as being actually ugly, the Zero Requiem is just Lelouch larping as a villain while Schneizel does the actual villains things so he can still look good.
Lelouch abolished apartheid to become the most hated tyrant of the world. Truly a genius (This is sarcasm, if anyone wonders, Lelouch's supervillain larp is bad even as larp)
Great points AOT aftermath reminds me of WW1's, Germany was left destroyed and with a ton of debt, and that resentment fueled fascism and Hitler's hard policies for fast growth and militarization Now imagine the survivors of humanity, all of them full of hatred and resentment, joining together against a common enemy Yeah that ain't going to be pretty Code Geass reminds me more of the aftermath of WW2's Europe, where all of the countries were too damaged and tired to wage war again on the short term, with the USA and URSS strong enough to become the new big powers In this case Suzaku and Schenider were the USA and URSS, its a much different scenario
> Code Geass reminds me more of the aftermath of WW2's Europe, where all of the countries were too damaged and tired to wage war again on the short term, with the USA and URSS strong enough to become the new big powers And then China reignited its civil war, featuring veterans of WW2 fighting each other almost inmediately after the victory celebrations and featuring things like the Siege of Changchun, where the Maoist forces killed as many people as the Nanjing Massacre. Then eventually Mao won and carried policies that killed tens of millions more. Oh and of course, you have the conflict between India and Pakistan after the collapse of the IRL British Empire, which lead to wars that killed millions of people too. Heck, even in Europe itself ("the peaceful"), you had things like the Continuation War, which was the aftermath of WW2 itself. And pretending itself was peaceful is hilarious, you had all tons of small conflicts and tensions, especially in Eastern Europe. > AOT aftermath reminds me of WW1's, Germany was left destroyed and with a ton of debt, and that resentment fueled fascism and Hitler's hard policies for fast growth and militarization. That's a way to excuse the people of Germany for their genocidal antisemitism and fantasies against Slavs. "Look, the Brits did bomb us during WW1, that's why I think we should kill the jews and enslave the slavs" Comparing Marley's revenge after the Rumbling with the Holocaust is very close to Nazi Apologia
>Comparing Marley's revenge after the Rumbling with the Holocaust is very close to Nazi Apologia There you go, playing the victim card, sorry man but that desnt work when there are actual superpowered individuals involved Why would the rest of the world not take revenge for the rumbling? This is a point in the post, the way Eren "fixed" things is fixing nothing Now you come and mention those flaws as anti semitism... as a counterargument? "Yes, the flaws n Eren's plan are going to cause a gigantic revenge from other countries" Your tone sounds like you are opposing the post, but your arguments are supporting it
Yes, exactly this!! The only thing Eren did was prove people's fear of Eldians ending the world *completely correct*. Okay, so he let the people *no one knows about* kill him. Cool. This does nothing to distract people from the fact that all it takes is *one* unhinged Eldian to end the world - doesn't matter how peaceful the others are. At absolute best, he just sealed their fate but kicked it down the road a few decades AND destroyed any country's incentive for keeping the island devils specifically alive (they clearly don't have any measures to actually stop anyone who wants to do the rumbling and has the ooert to do so (besides the obvious solution of just killing them)).
Eren didn't want to pull a Zero Requiem in the first place. He was doing a full rumbling and showed resistance to his friends so that they wouldn't interfere and would live long (jailing them is a good example). When he visits paths after Gabi shoots him, that's when he stops showing resistance to his friends and makes a speech to goad them and make himself the devil for the world. He then proceeded to save face in front of his friends and lie that he was pulling a ZQ all along until he spoke the truth in front of Armin, who didn't tell anyone else.
The AOT fandom has to have the biggest problem with reading comprehension I’ve ever seen. Eren was not trying to push no zero requiem type of plan he just wanted to kill those motherfuckers and he failed because of his friends. Eren wasn’t trying to break down any systems because there wasn’t going to be a system after he was done with the rumbling.
> The AOT fandom has to have the biggest problem with reading comprehension I’ve ever seen. Yeah, that pretty much summs you up to a T
> he just wanted to kill those motherfuckers and he failed because of his friends. Except the last chapter revealed that he always knew there was a good chance that he was gonna fail thanks to knowing the future and also because Ymir wanted it or something
More than that, Eren explicitly says everything he did was to arrive at Mikasa’s choice, which suggests Eren specifically orchestrated things so that his friends would end up killing him
Yep. Pretty sure Eren could alter Eldian DNA to turn them into bananas or something if he really wanted to win.
He only did that because he personally didn't want to go through with the full rumbling, setting up his friends to look like heroes was just an afterthought.
Let's ignore the fact that lelouch didn't need to become a tyrant to achieve peace. All of you who think aot did a cg ending clearly need to reread the last few chapters
Lelouch didn't need to become a tyrant? He literally did a shit ton of atrocities to even become emperor in the first place. Using geass on people to override their wills, commiting mass murders, and intentionally being a huge asshole when emperor so people would unite when he died (like when he held the leaders of multiple nations hostage)
Yeah and he didn't need to do any of that I believe the public didn't know he was zero. Dude just decided to cause more carnage and suffering cause the writers suddenly wanted to make him a martyr. Might I add this doesn't achieve any form or longterm peace
The public didnt know the identity of zero which is specifically why he asked suzaku to kill him while disguised as zero. The anime states that zero is not a person but a symbol, and that anyone can wear the mask as long as they represent the ideal of justice. Lelouch desired to make zero kill the tyrannical emperor for that reason, to solidify zero exactly as this symbol of justice to unite the world.
Yeah exactly he ruled like a tyrant instead of fixing the mistakes of his father and the rulers before him to then get killed and thinking it will create peace for more than a couple of days. For a "smart character" he really has no idea how humans work
> Yeah exactly he ruled like a tyrant instead of fixing the mistakes of his father and the rulers before him But isn't that exactly what he did? OP said it > the moment Lelouch takes the throne he then quickly abolished many policies that grew during Charles' era. These included the elimination of the aristocratic system, serious penalties for financial conglomerates engaging in or a part of illegal or illicit activities, and the abolition of the Number-Area system, thus liberating them. He did all the stuff that would actually free and liberate the people, albeit with the guise of ruling over them himself pretending to be an evil asshole
Which was unnecessary af why pretend when you can just be a good ruler ?
Because the idea is to create an enduring legacy in Zero specifically, not in himself. The whole thing was create an ideal that could not be defeated, in this case being "Zero, the liberator of justice" which would never die and unite the world. Also, he had already killed a bunch of people before that, ruling like some good guy would be not only hypocritical to his ideals but no different than the aristocracy beforehand. Why do you think the "The only people who should kill are those prepared to die themselves" line from the beginning of the series came back?
Look, that's completely dumb. Not even holy figures like Jesus or Buddha are as unifying as "MUH ZERO". Zero killing Lelouch would made him a hero, but that's because Lelouch decided to larp as a supervillain instead of just fixing things. > ruling like some good guy would be not only hypocritical to his ideals but no different than the aristocracy beforehand. I have some really bad news about how goverments work
Oh yeah killing himself definitely accomplishes more You do realise the world being united doesn't last forever ? Sure it might have been hypocritical to his ideals but if he wants results that should have been the right choice
> Might I add this doesn't achieve any form or longterm peace To be fair, it's pretty impossible to get pure longterm peace. Forming a relatively peaceful and cooperative world seems to be the best you can get, and that's what Lelouch did.
Maybe I'm misremebering something I haven'tread since it came out, maybe it was a bad fan translation- but didn't Armin flat out ask Eren if he was pulling a Zero Requiem? and Eren said no, I want to protect Paradis (specifically my friends on Paradis) and nuking 80% of the world is the best means to achieve this end.
Eren at first explains what he's doing and after this Armin asks him again. And Eren doesn't answer implying that he's not truly being honest. And at the end of their talk he even admits he just wanted to do the Rumbling in the first place The Zero Requiem stuff is him saving face, he intentionally stoked a fire under everyone's asses when he snuck into Marley to begin with
Armin: >Eren…. Did you push us all away…. Just so you could set us up as the heroes that save humanity from destruction? Eren: >That’s right. You all would then be the saviors to the people that survived. Even among the island devils, there were some that opposed my actions and kept their humanity. So I hoped that the world would hold you all in the highest regard. https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/2.jpg
None of them actually worked at all. Just the Code Gease seem to work because of the execution even then not believable. Plus don't think Eren wanted to do the Zero Requiem. He just wanted to protect his nation and friends from the freedom and peace the world wouldn't have given to them. Lelouch just destroyed his own nation and weakened it to the point they would end up only relying on Lelouch. It will lead to a power vacuum and other nations seeking power not peace at all. Similar situations happened in the world wars
*looks like you didn’t understand both story*
I do understand it but thing is conflict will always happen at the end no matter what even AoT proves that even after 100 years there was conflict although we dont know why Paradise Island got attacked after 100 years. Meanwhile another story thinks sacrificing one person will end conflict and create peace.
I think you missed the part where Lelouch left arguably the smartest character in CG to serve Zero, the symbol of justice, to retain peace. Also, Lelouch plan was never to remove all conflict. His main reason for living has always been giving Nunnally a peaceful world to live in, which he did. Eren left the world to literal nobodies.
Yeah and how would that still create peace lol. You can be the smartest person ever but conflict will still exist. Pretty much it is false peace. Even Naruto series is aware peace is lie conflict will still exist even when the 5 nations united. Eren never claimed he wants to make peace at all
I love how you're downvoted by pointing the fact that even Naruto has more realistic geopolitics than Code Geass (where everyone is apparently a guillible moron except for Zero)
Not Code Geass fans trying to compare the show to AOT again 😂 I mean, I'm also a Code Geass fan but AOT lives rent free in y'all head.
When two things get compared
Oh no, aot lives rent free in my head. 😱
It really does. CG fans jumping from one anime to another to retain relevance lmao
Oh no, it’s definitely not because AoT’s botched a copy of zero (iq) requiem. No, sir.
Stop being obsessed. AOT didn't copy Code Geass. If there was an anime to copy, it certainly isn't Code Geass. Get off your high horse. Your show isn't relevant anymore
Shut up you low life
Cry. 😂 No one cares about CG in 2023 You can only gain relevance by comparing CG with AOT
Cry harder little boy, you were the first one who shitted your pants and throwing bunch of BS and now you are acting like a pro clown, Aot fans always have been aweirdos and bunch of low lifes
😂 okay
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha. Yeah, it isn’t majorly from code geass. It’s called muv luv and eternal champions. 🫣
> eternal champions. Eternal Champion protagonist is someone who genocides **his own species**. The complete opossite of the Rumbling. Can Rumbling supporters stop lying?
I like how you’re implying such minor plot point disproves Isayama plagiarizing 99% of the plot of Eternal Champions. But sure, you do you.
> minor plot point If you think the target of the genocide is a minor plot point...well, you think that
It is, at the grand scheme of things. But then again, if you want to be purposely ignorant, you do you.
Eh, I'd say Iseyama might have taken something from Code Geass, but yes, Muv Luv and Eternal Champions is definitely there
AOT being compared to CG? No i dont want that, i want AOT to live rent free in my head for 10 years at least
Can Ozymandius' plan in Watchman be considered a Zero Requiem? Made me think of that.
The reason Zero Requiem worked for Code Geass and didn't for Attack on Titan is that Zero Requiem was writen in and for Code Geass, but not in and for Attack on Titan. Might sound obvious, a bit stupid, but that's how it is. Both series are different. The final conflict of Attack on Titan was a very intense mix of emotions; people were done with their life, sanity, hopes, civilization, everything. Eren wanted to kill so many things since the beginning of the story, then bombshell after bombshell of tragedies and revelations, things that happened, were happening, he had done, wanted to do, and many mysteries that popped here and there. This Zero Requiem plan, that isn't even part of this series, is just a surface understanding of events with different undertones and reasonings. It's like judging a steak as bad for not having ketchup like hamburgers do. Separate them, accept that they are different series, and accept they have nothing to do with each other. It just feels like many people didn't try to comprehend the artistic message of the author, they didn't want to be immersed nor respect it as its own thing. Seriously, Zero Requiem is the name of a plot point in a single series, it's not an universal concept; not everything that remotely resembles it is therefore it. An unrelated series with an unrelated plot must not be judged as if it was constructed to be exactly Code Geass just because a bunch of people died and the MC was killed at the end. Ever since the end of AoT back then, many people had so many weird comments, as if none had read the years of build up, the resolutions, the judgement, and personalities of the characters. It was simple cause and consequence in a broken world with broken people.
Well the sad thing is. Is That for Eren there was really no choice in the matter in preventing Genocide as the world was too hate filled to make peace and paradise who wanted to establish power over the world once more and Eren pick the best choice by planning a future we’re his friends live and in a way it succeed.
>Well the sad thing is. Is That for Eren there was really no choice in the matter in preventing Genocide as the world was too hate filled to make peace and paradise who wanted to establish power over the world once more and Eren pick the best choice by planning a future we’re his friends live and in a way it succeed. Eren had a choice like it was his choice doing genocide when they could have went for Zeke’s plan or do partial rumbling then do negotiations which was closer to what [Lelouch did with him showing the world the terrible strength of Fleija.](https://youtu.be/xnFdY7168DY) There’s more but the final arc was such a rush job that even the world building was so terrible it made every outsider nation look like comically evil irredeemable pieces of shit npcs.
>Eren had a choice like it was his choice doing genocide when they could have went for Zeke’s plan or do partial rumbling then do negotiations which was closer to what Lelouch did with him showing the world the terrible strength of Fleija.> Even if Eren were to do a partial rumbling as Armin suggested it would only delay the inevitable due to mordern technology gradually overcoming the power of the titans. What could Eren or Armin do if the nations of the world decide to bomb paradise from air assault, shred apart the titans with anti tank missiles or worse yet develop nuclear weapons? Never-mind that Zekes plan through sterilization is still genocide of an entire race. Which also likely not prevent the eldains from being massacred regardless by the world at large.
>Even if Eren were to do a partial rumbling as Armin suggested it would only delay the inevitable due to mordern technology gradually overcoming the power of the titans. Imagine your best strategist thinking their peace negotiations would fail without even trying… but then again, this was the same guy who wasn’t able to come up with anything in 4 years and was creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of attending meetings to save paradis. Lmao. >What could Eren or Armin do if the nations of the world decide to bomb paradise from air assault, shred apart the titans with anti tank missiles or worse yet develop nuclear weapons? Yeah, because paradis wouldn’t make technological advancements as well, they’d just sit on their asses depending on the power of the founder.
>Imagine your best strategist thinking their peace negotiations would fail without even trying… but then again, this was the same guy who wasn’t able to come up with anything in 4 years and was creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of attending meetings to save paradis. Lmao.> They did tried and failed, because nearly everyone else hated in the word hated the eldians on paradise island and fear they would wiped them out by the rumbling if they didn’t wiped them out first. The reason Armin could figure anything in four years wasn’t because he was too busy at his sealed up crush. It was do to the simple reason that people of the other nations are too unreasonable to negotiate. >Yeah, because paradis wouldn’t make technological advancements as well, they’d just sit on their asses depending on the power of the founder.> While also fighting against the combine armies of the entire world while their greatest weapons the titans have been made obsolete.
>They did tried and failed, because nearly everyone else hated in the word hated the eldians on paradise island and fear they would wiped them out by the rumbling if they didn’t wiped them out first. [Looks at how hard Armin was trying here, he’d literally turned invisible](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-27-chapter-107-visitor/24.jpg). 💀. [Look at all the plans they were able to tell eren when he asked about their plan.](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-27-chapter-107-visitor/30.jpg) 💀. [Uhhhhhhh, this shouldn’t have even been Eren’s line and yet he’s the one who brought it up.](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-27-chapter-107-visitor/27.jpg). When Eren said he’ll rumble their asses now, his best response was “[there must be some other way](https://cdn.readkakegurui.com/file/cdnpog/attack-on-titan/vol-34-chapter-139-moving-toward-that-tree-on-the-hill/15.jpg)”, like bitch? Didn’t i just give you 4 years to think of one and you sons of bitches thought of nothing?”💀. > The reason Armin could figure anything in four years wasn’t because he was too busy at his sealed up crush. It was so to the simple reason that people of the other nations are too unreasonable to negotiate. As i’ve said, it’s the result of terrible world building. > While also fighting against the combine armies of the entire world while their greatest weapons the titans have been made obsolete. Fighting, huh… interesting… the moment they do partial rumbling, fighting the eldians would be the last thing in their mind. Like making the wall titans literally encircle the island to ward off invaders would be a good deterrent.
>Looks at how hard Armin was trying here, he’d literally turned invisible. 💀. Look at all the plans they were able to tell eren when he asked about their plan. 💀. Uhhhhhhh, this shouldn’ have een Eren’s line and yet he’s the one who brought it up.. When Eren said he’ll rumble their asses now, his best response was “there must be some other way”, like bitch? Didn’t i just give you 4 years to think of one and you sons of bitches thought of nothing?”💀.> Likely because they couldn’t find way in those four years because the people in the world are completely unreasonable due to their hatred of Eldains which the manga had point out several times before-hand? I mean how is anyone suppose to find a solution to that aside from delaying the inevitable? >As i’ve said, it’s the result of terrible world building.> And terrible or not that is the reasoning why negotiations failed and why it is impossible for it to be solved in-verse. Just in the same way lelouch plan only worked because the world building in their allows it to make it possible. >Fighting, huh… interesting… the moment they do partial rumbling, fighting the eldians would be the last thing in their mind. Like making the wall titans literally encircle the island to ward off invaders would be a good deterrent.> Or it would just convince the other nations to build and entire army fleet planes to fly over their titans and bomb paradise to oblivion before they do a full on rumbling…which is one the main reasons why he wanted to eliminate paradise to begins with.
>Likely because they couldn’t find way in those four years because the people in the world are completely unreasonable due to their hatred of Eldains which the manga had point out several times before-hand? Again, it’s hard making up with plans when Armin was always shown creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of thinking up of anything, lmao. >I mean how is anyone suppose to find a solution to that aside from delaying the inevitable? Inevitable? Yeah, like how peace negotiations don’t exist. >And terrible or not that is the reasoning why negotiations failed and why it is impossible for it to be solved in-verse. It’s not impossible, they literally just did nothing to do something. >Just in the same way lelouch plan only worked because the world building in their allows it to make it possible. Lelouch’s plan worked because he actually thought what to do before and after he executed zero requiem like what I said in this post. >Or it would just convince the other nations to build and entire army fleet planes to fly over their titans and bomb paradise to oblivion before they do a full on rumbling…which is one the main reasons why he wanted to eliminate paradise to begins with. Like paradis couldn’t make them? Or the fact that eren literally could make countless flying jaw titans? Also, it’s hard to make advancements in technology when all your bases are destroyed.
>Again, it’s hard making up with plans when Armin was always shown creeping up on Annie’s crystal down the basement instead of thinking up of anything, lmao.< And what exactly would Armin be able to think of when all the negotiations did was direct the worlds hatred of the eldains to Marley to to those primarily to paradise? >Inevitable? Yeah, like how peace negotiations don’t exist.> When it comes to the Eldains and the rest of the world in Attack on Titan they clearly don’t. >It’s not impossible, they literally just did nothing to do something.> They tried to negotiate peace with an ally nation and the only thing they accomplish was redirect the worlds hatred from the Eldains in Marley to their own people on paradise. >Lelouch’s plan worked because he actually thought what to do before and after he executed zero requiem like what I said in this post.> Which again only worked because his own world building allowed it to happen. While Attack on titans on world building would make that impossible to happen. >Like paradis couldn’t make them? Or the fact that eren literally could make countless flying jaw titans? Also, it’s hard to make advancements in technology when all your bases are destroyed.> Eren does not have the power to create unique titans Ymir does and she wanted to flat out destroy the entire world when given the chance and this is completely ignoring that paradise is hopelessly outnumbered, outgunned and that is assuming they would somehow find out every single military base to world and destroy them without the use of the rumbling.
>And what exactly would Armin be able to think of when all the negotiations did was direct the worlds hatred of the eldains to Marley to to those primarily to paradise? Armin is the strategist, not me. He should think of one instead of being some kinda weirdo. It’s not like that’s the only way to get out of this, lmao. >When it comes to the Eldains and the rest of the world in Attack on Titan they clearly don’t. It does but they’re too stupid to try. >They tried to negotiate peace with an ally nation and the only thing they accomplish was redirect the worlds hatred from the Eldains in Marley to their own people on paradise. They tried? They literally sat around like deer on headlights, lmao. And their brilliant strategist was nowhere to be found. Oh, wait, he’s down there in the basement feeling up annie’s crystal like some creep. 🤦♂️ >Which again only worked because his own world building allowed it to happen. While Attack on titans on world building would make that impossible to happen. Like I said, better world building. Isayama is a hack who can’t write to save his life. >Eren does not have the power to create unique titans Ymir does and she wanted to flat out destroy the entire world when given the chance and this is completely ignoring that paradise is hopelessly outnumbered, outgunned and that is assuming they would somehow find out every single military base to world and destroy them without the use of the rumbling. Isn’t that basically the partial rumbling though? Which would give the, at least 50 years worth of time. Make your argument make sense, lmao.
Jesus fucking Christ I'm so sick of these dumbass Eren lelouch parallels. Eren plan/actions are literally nothing like Lelouch's because he didn't plan to save the world or anything at all. Eren's plan was the fucking rumbling. He **literally** wanted to kill all of humanity and only failed because he couldn't handle the guilt of what he was doing so he wanted to be stopped by having Mikasa kill him. There is no greater plan to save the world and he didn't believe Armin or anyone else's plan would work but just simply had to accept it since he knew he'd fail in the end anyway. Idk why tf people are over complicating shit when it's all there in black and white literally spelled out in the story itself.
The whole tricking the world thing has been done better and it’s still cheesy. Look at Watchmen, which is a literal masterpiece and mfs still completely miss points all the time. It’s a hyper realistic world and the final villains final plan is “squid monster kill some save many”, it’s a parody of sci fi writing itself. The other characters are looking at Veidt, the smartest man ever, like “you are so dumb yet so smart” and it works. The movie fucked up bc Zack Snyder couldn’t see the absurd side and actually just thought watchmen was another gritty and cool super comic when it’s half a parody of previous gritty comics (TDK Daredevil anything Frank miller tbh.) AoT is like Code Geass but worse lmao, Eren is a bullheaded moron who’s also got a god complex. Then they reveal the future sight lmao so the plot shapes up to be “eren see, Eren do” he becomes a slave to his fate and not in smart way bc he never tried to fight it either. He just do, never looks for counsel just gets a bunch of likeminded idiots together and creates a cult of personality while escalating everything to do or die. Then we get another future sight 4d chess move bc Eren see his friends stop him and he dies for everyone along with the billions of innocent people he killed but he did it for his homies he’s such a genius. If I was 15 and only read manga I would think this was genius but I’m not and I’ve read actual brilliant shit lmao. Eren see Eren do baby